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To the person who decided to lift my words from this blog, I notice that my exact words are in the Washington Post!

Article: "Ties That Align" by Krissah Thompson, 3/18/2009
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Tuesday, August 12, 2008

INVESTIGATING OUR DIFFERENCES



I saw this video today and there are many interesting viewpoints that I thought this brotha shared that are useful for the discussions that we are having at this blog about the barriers to solidarity and the barriers to our self-actualization.

I believe that it will be valuable for us to discuss the barriers to solidarity that he identifies.

In the greeting that is located on this blog's sidebar, I reference Dr. bell hooks' two-minute audio clip, titled, "Investigating Our Differences". She says:

One reasons why I go back to the question of love and hope is it was Imamu Amiri Baraka who first said to me, and then publicly, that monolism is not revolutionary, that we need hope. We need to believe in order to create our political movements, in order to strengthen community. We need to believe in the power of community even when our communities are failing us.

Those of you in recovery know that you hear so often "act as if". I think it is important for us to act as if in the process of community-making, even if there are flaws in our struggle. Because as long as we act as if, we keep alive our hope and our belief in community. I think when you speak about love in relation to political movements and ending 'dominater culture', we are constantly working against the sentimental patriarchal notions of love,and talking about that love that energizes you, that gives you the courage, that allows you to go forward one more time.

I love Sweet Honey In The Rock when they say, 'When we work for freedom we can not rest, until it's done. It constantly reminds me to go that extra step, in relation to someone else, in relation to people that I may not be interested in. Do I really want to take time with this white person to let them know something? Do I really want to take time, you know, with a bourgie black woman that I think is dissing me?"

"...Making community with people who are different from you is different than making community with those who are like you.... White supremacy has impinged upon us so much that we do not spend enough time investigating our differences..."


In June, I began a discussion at this blog about "Re-examining Barriers To Community".

In the audio tape, Dr. hooks asks: "What does it mean to embrace difference in community?

She says that, "If you do not have a core of self love, difference will be threatening to you in community." I want to talk about how our self love will impact our activism. We know that self love is tied to self-acceptance and self-acceptance is tied to self-esteem. Self-esteem is tied to self-definition.

Those who permit others to formulate definitions of them will often wrestle with self-acceptance and will have self-esteem issues. I spend a lot of time in discussions at this blog insisting that black women begin to define themselves to themselves and for themselves - individually and collectively. In two posts, I offered a series of "who am I" questions.

Whenever I am part of a gathering of sistas, I often notice that there is an undercurrent of collusion that enforces uniformity in thought. If one woman shares a point of view that others do not share, there is sometimes hostility that is expressed by others. Eyes dart to others in the room. Someone may speak up and share another viewpoint but will usually apologize for thinking differently than the person who has just spoken. Why do we even apologize for expressing our own experience in a way that differs from another woman's experience?

If I think differently than you do, if I had a different upbringing than you did, if I live differently than you do, why is that a threat to who you are? Dr. hooks targets the root of it all: a lack of self love.

If I love myself, I will celebrate the uniqueness of others.

If I love myself, I will appreciate knowing that there are differences among people within my race and within other races.

If I love myself, I will not feel diminished if no one validates my personal history or perspectives. If self-love is not common within our race, then how does this dynamic of impact how we will be in community with one another?

What is it about black solidarity and gender solidarity that causes so many to believe that the expression of our diversity in thought is the beginning of conflict?

I have lost count of the number of times that I have encountered others who expressed resentment and jealousy when hearing that all black people do not have the same socioeconomic background. People have said to me, "you are nothing like I had imagined when we first met". My response is usually, "well, do you always attempt to define who someone is and what they are all about when you've just met them?" I usually receive silence to that question. The truth is, yes, many people do make a practice of formulating definitions of persons they do not know.

We were discussing transgendered women a few weeks ago. A few people were uncomfortable with my position the fluidity of gender that a person chooses to embrace is not the decision of the community. Most will agree that each person should decide for himself/herself about how to express gender. Do we openly demonstrate that we understand this? If all of us demonstrated this understanding, then transgendered PoC would not feel ostracized within their own race. Effeminate gay men would not be ridiculed when walking down the street.

As we investigate our differences, let's identify the ways we attempt to enforce our definitions on other people:
- Collusion
- Hostility
- Rejection
- Imagined offenses
- Discrimination
- Ridicule


The more secure we are in our own identity, the less threatened and hostile we will become towards those who express an identity that is outside of what we have believed to be commonly-embraced.

I remember in a prior discussion at this blog that I said that I was not a feminist or a womanist. I remember the reactions of a few: "oh yes you are!" Why is it that we can not accept a person's self-definition? Is it that we have a need to control how others define who they are?

If a transgendered woman says, "I am a woman", why is it that we have to say "oh no you are not!" Why do we feel it is so harmful to our psyche to allow others to define themselves as they choose to? What is inside of us that refuses to allow the expression of differences?

Why was Tiger Woods ridiculed by blacks for choosing his own definition of his ancestral background? Is he not entitled to define himself as he chooses to? I heard so many people sneering, "he's trying to say he's not black!" My response was: "just how does his self-definition impact your life?"

May I share an observation that may make some people uncomfortable? Those who are insecure about their own self-definition tend to have the most venom unleashed towards those who are secure about theirs. Those who are insecure about their own self-definition are quick to speculate on another person's reasons for adopting a self-definition that differs from the one they want to give them.

I read several online discussions where people were mentioning that Soledad O'Brien did not mention that 1/4 of her ancestry was African when she began her career in journalism. My response in those discussions was: "So? Can a person evolve? As a person evolves, can that person be allowed to change his/her self-definition?" There were remarks being made online that Soledad was attempting "to pass" early in her career. Really? Do you know her personally? Do you know her parents and their views about self-definition? Some people think they can enforce rules about self-definition upon others. I don't care if Soledad defined herself as Latina at one point in her life and then changed her self-definition to black-Latina at another point in her life. Her self-definition does not influence my existence.

Someone asked me, "will Halle Barry identify her baby as black?" I was wondering, "why do any black people even care?" Isn't it her decision to define her own child's ancestry as she chooses to? Why should we discuss the identity a mother gives her child who has 1/4 African ancestry?

I have heard the argument that black people are being manipulated by those PoC who change their self-definition. No one manipulates you without your permission.

I've heard that there are benefits that blacks receive that others can attempt to take for themselves by stating they are black. Really? Which benefits? Academic scholarships? Hundreds and thousands of dollars in scholarship money goes unused every year! Social services? Which publicly-subsidized services are only accessible to blacks? There is no reason at all for blacks to enforce parameters of "self definitions" upon all persons who have percentages of African ancestry in their gene pool. The resentment is actually rooted in the privilege that others have exercised of being able to claim any part of one's ancestry at any time.

Investigating our differences requires that we ask ourselves about how and why we react to the definitions that others give themselves.

I hear many ministers saying that this country is a Christian nation and was founded on Christian principles? Really now. "All men are created equal." Tell that to the Native Americans. Tell that to the Africans of the Diaspora. The U.S. is not a Christian nation; it is the fourth-largest non-Christian nation in the world. I am not in a nation where Christianity is being embraced. Most Americans do not live Christian lifestyles. I am in a nation where the label of Christianity is placed on any type of bigotry, classism, sexism or racism that persons choose to espouse. Most of the descriptions I have heard of Christianity in the last twenty years (from those who profess they are Christians) are either inaccurate or blatantly false.

In the video at the beginning of this post, we hear a black man sharing the experiences he has had among blacks as an openly gay man. The disrespect that he mentions is not uncommon in our community or in mainstream society. People are often blatantly disrespectful. There are rules of this blog that are violated by bloggers who feel entitled to disrespect - and to return!

I can remember an elderly deacon in our church openly ridiculing a transgendered woman who was a friend of mine. He felt entitled to disrespect.

I often read rules that blog hosts have posted. Very often, blog hosts are admonishing people about being disrespectful towards others in the comment section. I want to investigate whether self-hatred is at the root of the actions that reflect an entitlement to disregard. Do we dare unpack the entitlement to disregard?

Can we be part of the change we seek? How?

The gentlemen in the video mentions that he encountered collusion from those who were observing the actions of entitlement to disregard. As we investigate our differences, we have to examine social dynamics that exist.

Are we as outraged about the rape of a lesbian by another lesbian as we are about the rape of a heterosexual military woman by a white military official?

We know that "injustice anywhere is a threat to injustice everywhere." Why don't we speak up when someone else is being infringed upon? Is it too costly? Or is it that we agree with the discrimination we see and so we remain silent?

Conflict in any aspect of our environment will impact all of us eventually. Those who paid no attention to the gangs forming on another side of town are infuriated that the crime has entered their section of town. Those who looked the other way at crime in the ghettos are not infuriated that crime is rampant in their suburbs. Conflict will impact everyone eventually.

I have posed a number of questions, but may I share a few more?


How will our differences in upbringing serve as an asset in collective activism?

How will our class differences serve as an asset?

How will our differences in spiritual background serve as an asset?


We need to understand how our differences are going to be leveraged as assets. If we do not know, then we will continue to operate with a conspiracy of false unity.

This is why it is important for us to discuss new methods of how "to investigate our differences," as Dr. hooks says, "in order to come together."

16 COMMENTS:

jamericanmuslimah said...

Thank you for this post! I have to say as a Black woman who is also Muslim (and wears the modest clothing and headscarf) I have been met with hostility, resentment and at times, disrespect from other Black people because of my choice to be Muslim. (Especially in today's anti-Muslim climate). Apparently, some Black people believe "All Black people are Christians." Hmm...really? Do they know that African-Americans make up half of the United States' Muslim population?

The worse part has been that people treat me like I am no longer Black because I'm Muslim. Sometimes they behave as if I have no right to speak on issues that affect the African-American community.

I still believe it is possible to work across our differences for the betterment of the community. The question is, do others?

lola said...

This was a good read, I love the topic.

I agree that when you know, accept, and can define who you are you don't feel the need to give an identity to others. People who are insecure are the ones who judge and put labels on others most.

On Jamericanmuslimah's situation : I am so shocked to hear this, then again I shouldn't be, but I never had a problem with blacks being non-christians. I know blacks who are jewish, buddhist, muslim, just spiritual or simpy atheist, and there's nothing wrong with that!

On mixed people : The other day, I was having a conversation with other folks on race, and a question came up "what are Amerie, Kidada Jones, Alicia Keys, Halle Berry, Shemar Moore" and a few other names. Basically, my answer was "Amerie and Kidada are mixed, Alicia is now black, Halle and Shemar are black people". Some people told me I wasn't logical. Some said they were all mixed, others said they were all blacks. I replied that although technically they're mixed, I call them what they call themselves because I have no right to DEFINE them. Amerie is blasian and Halle is black. There's nothing to discuss imo and I respect both ladies choices.

On transgenders : I have no respect for so called "children of God" who feel entitled to disrespect another God's child for being different. I always thought since nature wasn't perfect, people could be born in the wrong body, ever since I was a teen. People don't change sex for "fun", it's a huge risk and years and years of sacrifice, treatments, sufferings to finally become "YOU".

Many black people still want "one" identity. You can be as darkskinned as Alek Wek, if you don't eat soulfood, if you speak different languages, if you're into country music and rock and don't listen to rap, you're not "really black". I'm curious about other cultures, do said "non-black" activities, am attracted to non-BM, I'm not "really black". Some people don't LIKE the way I live my life and my state of mind. I'm slowly changing my environment because I CHOSE to be myself even if that means cutting some people off, family or friends. I'm not gonna fake it and be miserable to appease people's feelings.

So my question is, does the black community WANT to embrace differences? Maybe they do but are scared. In Highschool I had a friend who would do in front of others things to prove she was "black" but when you talked to her privately she said she was scared of being herself because she feared rejection. Maybe MILLIONS of blacks secretly want to be themselves, including those who "act black", but worry too much about others. We're still in stuck in "teenagehood" when it comes to defining what "being black" is.

ms.kimba412 said...

I believe differences should be celebrated, but I also believe in right & wrong. re: trangendered individuals - I disagree that "God put them in the wrong body". Instead - I believe they've chosen a gender different from the one they were born into. Is it their choice - absolutely.

When I was a hairstylist I worked with a transsexual, and she was very open about it. I could never imagine anyone disrespecting her because of her choice. But again - it's a choice. Not God's mistake.

Miriam said...

The Bible states that the homosexual "act" is an abomination. While it never stated one ought hate these type of people, people seem to think this is the safe bet to place their raging hate towards. Its safe to hate them.

I also worry about rejection because of being Jewish.

I guess until we recognized that there are many "truths" in the world, relative truths to each person; and stop trying to impose our truths upon others, things will remain.

re: spiritual background serving as an asset.

I think alot of us, or at least our parents are converts into a religion. This is a big role because the purpose of a convert is to sway the group inch by inch, convert by convert into whatever path we're suppose to go into. (this makes for some to hate the convert, others embrace us).

So, I believe we all can make a difference especially if we extract the love and unity that our spiritual beliefs promote and extended it as it should be extended.

blackgirlinmaine said...

I am tired but this is an amazing post.

Lisa said:
The more secure we are in our own identity, the less threatened and hostile we will become towards those who express an identity that is outside of what we have believed to be commonly-embraced.

The older I get the more I believe this to be true. Its my experience that as I have become secure in who I am, the less troubled I am with folks who fall outside the box especially as it relates in my case to being a Black woman.

I think the question you posed on class difference is a critical question. So many times I think as people of color, we forget that there are class differences and its the issue of class that because we don't discuss it, it keeps us separate and in that space where we think we should all be the same. Yet how could we possibly be all the same? Yes, we may share a gender and a race but we are so much more than that. Some of us were raised with resources, some not and all those experiences shape and inform us at people.

The funny thing is for me living in a rather homogenous (white) state, I see how big a role class plays in day to day life. In that one of the reasons my move here was less traumatic than some figured it would be is because on a class-level, it was easy for me to connect with others from a working class background regardless of race.

Yet if we were able to have a true dialogue on class I think it would be an asset because once we can acknowledge the role class has in shaping our perspective, the less likely will be to jump on the those who despite looking like us are different.

More later, my thoughts are getting jumbled.

lola said...

it's a choice. Not God's mistake.

I never said God made mistakes I said nature wasn't perfect. When a child is born blind that's an imperfection of nature, not a mistake from God. When a child is born a hermaphrodite, imperfection of nature, not God's mistake. When a child is born a boy but always behaved like a girl and believed he was one without anyone telling him anything about him "being a girl", until he realized in shock at 4 yo the physical difference between boys and girls, leading to a psychological trauma as a kid, it's another imperfection of nature in my eyes. One of my best friends is a transgender.

I never said these imperfections were God's mistakes, whatever is allowed by God isn't a mistake for it happens for a reason (blindness, herma, trans, etc), but I call them imperfections of nature. People make choices, I agree, but based on an imperfection that wasn't a choice in the first place.

I don't claim to be "right", its a simple opinion, you and I can see things from different perspectives, I just had to make myself clear about "God's mistake".

Laverne said...

Thanks so much to reaching out to me and wanted to include my photo on your site. I'd be honored.

It's so refreshing and inspiring to see a blog that attempts to look at issues of gender and sexuality as relates to black folks in a complicated nuanced way. It actually makes me want to cry.

As transgender woman I don't believe that my personally being trans is a mistake of nature. I feel like god made me this way. I've just had a different journey to move closer to myself. Trans people have existed throughout history. I feel in a continuum with that, that I have a fate that's specifically tied to me being between, being trans.

Stay in the love,

Laverne Cox

Evia said...

Lisa, your topics provoke so much thought!

I think many bw WANT to change and they can logically agree with everything you say because it's so compellingly said, however their emotions are informed by their experiences of various types with others and most human beings are emotion-driven. Emotions tend to change slowly--even illogical ones.

For ex. I embrace differences, so I TOTALLY agree with everything you've said here. I'm very attracted to people who are from different cultures and/or people who bring diverse ideas to my table. However, my experiences with other AAs are not good in that department. When I come into a largely AA group, I can listen to their views and it's just fine. I am enriched by their views because I learn about another slice of life. However, when I present my views which usually diverge from the AA party line, there is agitation, intolerance, anger, and then CONFLICT. Only stupid people continue to invite conflict. So I want to get away from people like that and I do. I go and find like-minded people.

Some people have said to me that I should just stay in those AA settings and keep bringing my ideas because this will help some of those other AAs to grow, but I'm not a saint, not a minister nor a masochist.

At this point, I ONLY want to mingle with people who are like-minded or similarly-minded because I want to avoid conflict, which I consider heat and no light or too little light to make the conflict worth it to me.

So on an intellectual level, your arguments are flawless, however as I said, MOST humans are largely driven by emotions--not logic. LOL! Many of us might want to help people, but if they're trying to beat you down, most of us are going to move away from those people and FAST.

I've noticed that for most AAs I've encountered, if you have not had the SAME experiences that they've had, then something is wrong with YOU, and they lash out. LOL! If you think differently than them, something is wrong with YOU, and they lash out. There's no further thought (critical thinking) about it on their part and if you insist on being true to yourself (which I'm always going to do), many times, this causes them to attack.

I have absolutely nothing against homosexuals or transgendered folks or any other persuasion. Actually, I've never even understood why anyone has a problem with homosexuals. As long as any person's sexual or lifestyle preference is not harming anyone, they're just fine with me. I think we should all support people who are just being themselves. But as I said, homophobia alike racism alike sexism and many other isms and phobias are emotion-driven.

When I've spoken out against homophobia (because I definitely don't want my children to be homophobic), SOME blacks of various ethnicities who I've been around, become agitated--to say the least. Maybe the whites I'm around become agitated too when I express my views, but they don't lash out.

Yet if we were able to have a true dialogue on class I think it would be an asset because once we can acknowledge the role class has in shaping our perspective, the less likely will be to jump on the those who despite looking like us are different.

Yes, class is a BIGGIE. MOST AAs cannot acknowledge class differences. Class is the ONE word that I'd NEVER mention among some of the AAs I know offline because it sends a typical AA person into a rage, especially if they **think** you're in a higher class.

wisdomteachesme said...

Glory my sister lisa,

i see the Spirit of the Lord Breaths when and where it needs to. i am so grateful to God for His love.

I have learned from spending much time with God that i cannot clean my feet by washing my face.
No one can.

It is something else,
to have so many people (not just at blogs)--speak about God concerning who He loves and who He will and will not choose and call for His Purposes. lol

i must say, that even though so many people think that, 'i' have all this power over myself-over my heart and that 'i' can make myself Only love women intimately and that 'i' can purpose my heart to Only be attracted to the woman You gave me and that so many people can never accept or include 'me' in their groups--i must say, i will continue to pray asking God to give these people what they need to complete themselves.

That so many people also think that 'i' want their acceptance and the inclusion of my life with theirs keeps me shaking my head.
All because I Love.

I am who i am--i long ago accepted myself as a whole human being-a Child of the most high God Who loves and accepts me. I am very comfortable with who He created me to be.
I tried living as the woman others said i was to be--hatedit!!!
didn't work!!!
I could not lie to myself or anyone else.

sorry, i will not go into the box that so many people have created to keep me in, so that they feel comfortable about their lack, issues, and confusion. sorry.

and guess what? I don't want them to live in a box either! Even if they are not comfortable about who they have been created to be.
I still do not reject any of the people that fit into this group, even as they reject people like me.

There are Two ways=living a lie or living the truth. many of 'us' choose to live in the truth of who we are--it is so much easier than faking it!

i know there are those of you out there who know what i am talking about! lol i know you are there :)


I know how small i am in the scheme of His plans and How Grateful-humbly Grateful i am that i am important to Him and that I fit into His plans on the Grander scale.

I am so glad that God does not belong to any one group of people that He created. and that right here in my home full of His love, that my family lives in and within our human temples, I Know That God lives right here with me and my family keeping us Highly Favored and Highly Blessed.
We stay teachable to His Spirit.

I am so sorry for and i pray often for the people who were taught to hate differences and/or themselves.

Sister Lisa,
the Spirit spoke to us both about the same subject--Glory Be To God In The Name of Jesus.

"Who Taught You To Hate"
http://wisdomteachesme.blogspot.com/

wisdomteachesme said...

Opps--sorry

this="my heart to Only be attracted to the woman You gave me and that so many people can"
-----
should be this=

"my heart to Only be attracted to the woman 'He' gave me and that so many people can..."

Black Mother said...

You touched on a number of issues in your post and there is no way that I'll be able to respond to it all.

Instead I will share with you my belief about WHY we are threatened when someone has a different opinion, chooses another lifestyle, or just plain out engages in behavior we do not understand.

We live in a society where there are many different classifications, groups, races, tribes, categories, kinds of people, types of people, subdivisions, subgroups...you get my point. And at the end of the day each group has something to say about the other.

That does not make this behavior acceptable, but let me continue.

If you look back over the list that you provided us with that identifies the ways we attempt to enforce our definitions on other people, you will see that this was going on before any of your readers were born. The first explorers to visit Africa, and America shared this same attitude.

Right now, we see this going on with our politicians as it gets closer to November. We witness these personal attacks on shows like The View, and Bill O'Reilly. Our country promotes the idea that every body has not only an opinion but can "Have it Their Way."

And as educated and intelligent as some of us are, we can not claim exemption.

So, half of the problem is that we are living in a nation whose very nature is to put up barriers and more barriers and then force the people to navigate through them in order to respect the lifestyle of someone they may encounter on a daily basis or have personal dealings with.

On the issue of class...

I was watching an interview with Bill Gates a few years ago. When asked about his views on class he said that he remembered reading a book about John D. Rockerfeller in which John was quoted as saying something like (I'm paraphrasing here) class ONLY matters to those without any wealth, those without any real valuable possessions like lands, deeds, and contracts. Contracts in which people are indebted to you by a language barely understandable -even to those who've prepared them.

LISA VAZQUEZ said...

Welcome JamericanMuslimah!

Thank you for startin goff this conversation!

I had to make some changes in the post when I realized the wrong draft was appearing online. (Forgive me for the oversight!)

You are correct in observing that there is a lot of disassociation among blacks towards black Muslims. This is rooted in a lack of clarity about Muslim doctrine and about how Islam will contribute to the advancement of the black people in this country.

There are plenty of people who think that all blacks who are Muslim are associated with N.O.I. when most black Muslims I have met have told me that N.O.I. is not believed to be representative of Islam but other muslims.

I believe that there is an entrenched misperception that black Muslims want to distance themselves from non-Muslims in the black community and will only "deal with" them when it is necessary.

Many black people harbor assumptions that Islam does not represent liberation but represents conformity and thereby enforcing solidarity by religious legalism.

Many black people harbor assumptions that Christianity is a "white man's religion that was introduced to the slave" which is completely false since the Bible mentions that the Ethiopian eunuch had the parchments with him so Africans KNEW of God's word before they came here as slaves.

There are just so many misperceptions and assumptions.

I have a question for you:
What role does Islam have in dismantling white supremacist, patriarchal constructs in our society today?

Thanks again for your insights and I look forward to hearing more from you!

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
_________________________________

Welcome Lola!

You touched upon a very important point... the fear of rejection that fuels the conformity of thought. I have been around blacks who were well-educated who "suddenly" began to speak English with incorrect verbs and incomplete sentences when they were around black people with less education.

I do believe that many black people (not ALL!) want to emhrace "one" identity... it is NEVER going to be possible. The irony is that many whites think blacks are a monolithic group!

I have lost count of the number of notes I have in my in box of white readers telling me how stunned and enlightened they are to read the conversations at this blog.

I immediately hit the delete button on that!

Why is it so shocking to find that blacks do not think alike, that they do not all come from the same class background or educational background? Why is it so "enlightening" to find a room full of black women who think deeply about a variety of issues that impact collective advancement?

I fail to understand how encountering THAT produces such an awakening!

Let's not forget how "wow1amazing!" Michelle Obama is to some people...is it simply because she's a black woman with two Ivy League degrees and a solid career? That makes her oh-so-shocking and so incredibly rare among blacks? Really.

I just shake my head when I hear comments that imply that she's an "exception" to blacks. What an insult. Is Hillary an "exception" among white women? Is Cindy??

This "one identity" mentality is being openly encouraged by non-blacks; it has been encouraged since slavery.

You have brought some good points to this discussion!

Please share more!

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
_________________________________

Welcome MsKimba412!

Thank you so much for finding this blog! I hope that there are some valuable discussions that will keep you coming back to share with all of us!

I understand that many people believe that transgenders CHOOSE to be transgender.

Is it possible that in the womb that a fetus does not develop in the way that is expected? Yes. Babies are born with two genitalia. Babies are born with missing limbs. Babies are born no sight.

I am not implying that those who are transgenders are "missing" anything prior to birth, but I am just pointing out that ALL fetuses are not developing in the same way.

I have seen news stories of cojoined babies born who are sharing one organ. A number of things can occur in the womb.

Therefore, I will not rule out the possibility that SOMETHING has occurred in the womb and the sexual organ of the fetus is developed but still there is an aspect of the development of the fetus that did not occur. I am not a doctor and do not claim to be. I am just stating possibilities.

I don't feel that God made a mistake when a blind baby is born or when a baby is born with no limps. I don't feel God made a mistake when there is a fetus that develops differently.

You have raised a crucial issue so let's examine it more closely.

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
_________________________________

Welcome Miriam!

Thank you for stopping by my neighborhood!

I have to stop by your blog more often!

You have raised some interesting viewpoints. I always tell those in church who ask me "as a minister, what is YOUR VIEW on gays and lesbians?" and I ask them "what does GOD say?"

One problem in the black church is the willingness of so many to listen to a PERSON and not study the Bible diligently. I hear "my pastor says...." and I respond, "and what does GOD's word say?"

I have encountered people who claim that they believe the direct quotes from Jesus reflect what was the most important to Jesus. If Jesus didn't speak on it then it must not have been THAT important, they tell me. "Oh really?" I ask.
{shaking my head}

There are those who think Christianity is a religion. I do not.

In another blog discussion, I mentioned the booklet, "Religion or Christ: What's The Difference?"

http://www.rbc.org/uploadedfiles/Bible_Study/Discovery_Series/PDF/Religion_Or_Christ.pdf

You made an interesting point about converts.

I don't believe that I can CONVERT anybody. I don't preach sermons with an intent to CONVERT anyone. God changes the hearts. I don't issue any admission tickets to Heaven.

I love that you said:
"So, I believe we all can make a difference especially if we extract the love and unity that our spiritual beliefs promote and extended it as it should be extended."

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
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Welcome BlackGirlInMaine!

I agree with your comments and thank you for sharing them!

I have encountered MANY black people (and white people) who want to cling to this false assumption that all blacks are from the same socioeconomic class.

Too many black people I have met were floored to see where I grew up. Oprah mentioned in an interview that her mother was a maid and Gail's mother HAD a maid.
A few of my friends would say that about me.

I remember a few women were offended that I mentioned class! "Why do you mention class so much at your blog?!" they sneered.

"Class matters" as bell hooks has said.

Class matters in this country.

Class impacts every aspect of our lives.

I heard one sista say, "we're black so we're all the same".

No, we are not all the same.

There are millions of blacks who are trapped in the underclass (not even the lower class!) and have NEVER had the experiences I had as a black girl. I was floored when I saw the footage of the people in poverty in New Orleans when the national media attention focused on the Katrina cloud-seeding disaster (ummm...I mean, the hurricane).

Entire families were living in quarters that were smaller than our garage.

When I was very small, I believed that I would never face poverty in my lifetime.

I grew up feeling assured that I could have ANYTHING I wanted to have and that I could become ANYTHING I wanted to be.

I haven't met many blacks who had that expectations ingrained in their psyche as young children. Class matters!

Seeing Obama win the presidential nomination made some black people feel that "now we know what is possible".

I felt sad reading those conversations on so many blogs.

Why?

I always knew that it was possible for a black person to hold the most powerful position in the world. Obama has not shown me to ANYTHING I was not already being told was possible when I was five! My father would watch the news and he would shake his head sometimes and point to the television and say, "I know you will do something about this mess when YOU get to be president!" I would look up from my toys and smile: "okay daddy".

It was ALWAYS fostered in our home that class privilege would trump race privilege when wielded effectively. I knew it to be true because I saw many disadvantaged whites. My very first encounter with whites was to see them as domestics.

Will ALL blacks say that? No.

Because class does matter in how we see the world and how we view out place in the world.

We really should discuss this more. I thank you for raising this issue!

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
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Welcome Laverne!

Thank you so much for dropping in!

I have added my favorite photo of you to this blog!

You are welcome to do a guest post if there is an issue you want to address with the readers of this blog!

I won't be a stranger at your blog so please feel welcome to visit often!

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
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Welcome Evia!

You nailed it!

I am so thankful that you jumped into this conversation!

You have several hundred posts so if you have written on this issue, please feel welcome to share the links to specific posts!

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
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Welcome WisdomTeachesMe!

It's good to see you again!

Thanks for sharing a post with us!

If you ever notice that you typed something and you want to repost your comment, you can click on the trash can icon on the lower left and then copy and paste it in as a new comment that includes your correction!

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
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Welcome BlackMother!

Thank you so much for finding this blog!

I think that John was speaking from a mindset of male privilege, race privilege AND class privilege....so of course he will say that class doesn't matter to those who were part of the socioeconomic elite.

He was deluded in his assessment that it doesn't matter to those in his own class when their position of economic rule safely ensured economic domination of others.

John also said:
"The way to make money is to buy when blood is running in the streets."

Class matters to the super rich and to the very poor.

He was lying.

You are more than welcome to post long comments, if you'd like.

There is a one page limit at this blog! Share freely. Feel free to disagree as much as you want!

I know that other blogs only allow responses that are ten sentences or less. Not here! Over here, we want everyone to blow the trumpet! (smiles)

Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa

Black Mother said...

No disagreements here, although I should have been much clearer in my previous post and said that I do not share the same views as John.

However, I thought what he said was very interesting because he was not always wealthy. He grew up poor.

So it got me to thinking, that maybe after you accumulate a certain amount of wealth, class is no longer an issue that keeps you from relating and understanding others. I don't know.

Just a thought!

Trina said...

Self-love and positive-mindedness are crucial to progressing towards the unity our community continues to severely be lacking. I work in the public schools of ATL and see yet another generation struggling to recognize and individually identitfy who they are and how they will survive and fit into this world. The structures my generation were blessed to lean on in the places of worship, schools, community and civic centers/groups for young people, esp. the extended families/neighbors who could feel free to stop you out on the street and correct your behavior - these things are becoming a distant memory and a figment of the imagination for those coming of age now - I like the idea of "each one, reach one", starting your own small nucleus of networking and hopefully influencing those in your circle for the good...the consequences of remaining in our own tiny cubicles are devastating us!!

lola said...


There are those who think Christianity is a religion. I do not.

I don't either. To me being a Christian is believing in CHRIST, isn't that where the words "Christian/Christianity" come from? So you can be Christian and still not be part of any religion, that's how I feel.

wisdomteachesme said...

"To me being a Christian is believing in CHRIST, isn't that where the words
"Christian/Christianity" come from? So you can be Christian and still not be part of any religion, that's how I feel."
----
thank you for saying this.